How to Qualify a Cluster Configuration
Posted April 22, 2003
Chat Date: April 7, 2003
Please note: Portions of this transcript have been edited for clarity
Chat Participants:
- Shawn Becker, WHQL Server and WHQL Cluster Test Support
- Jason Whittecar, Developer in the Storage Services team, Windows group
- Jamie Hanrahan, Owner, Azius Developer Training
- Daryn Rank, Support Manager for WHQL support teams
- Lyndon Bethel, Enterprise Storage WHQLRaid support and test lead
- Laura Keller, Program manager, Technical & Strategic Communications
- Zubair Ansari, Program Manager, windows clustering
- Eric Sassaman, Program manager, Product Support Services
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Moderator: Eric (Microsoft)
Welcome to today's Chat. Our chat is on How to Qualify a Cluster Configuration.
Moderator: Eric (Microsoft)
Let's introduce our hosts for today!
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Shawn Becker: WHQL Server and WHQL Cluster Test Support
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Jason Whittecar: Team Lead - WHQLClus and WHQLServ Support
Host: Daryn (Microsoft)
Hi - My name is Daryn, I am Support Manager for WHQL support teams,
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Hi! My name is Lyndon Bethel. I am the Enterprise Storage WHQLRaid support and test lead.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Zubair-msft, Program Manager, windows clustering
Moderator: Eric (Microsoft)
Welcome everyone, let's get started! Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: What is the difference between a Server submission and a Cluster Server Block submission?
A: A server submission is for a server only. A cluster server block is a logo qualified server plus a host bus adapter.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: Does windows 2000 cluster cert still exists after RTM of Windows 2003
A: Yes.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: What additional tests will be needed to run for the Cluster Server Block submission?
A: Each component must be previously logo qualified. The testing for Cluster Server Block consists of the following:
• CheckLogo
• Signed Driver Check
• Validate 1 Node Cluster
• Validate N Node Cluster
• Move N Node Cluster
Host: Daryn (Microsoft)
Q: When would you expect W2K to follow Windows 2003 Block concept?
A: It is currently available for W2K
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: The windows 2000 cluster cert, is it similar to what was being accepted for fibre channel adapters?
A: Please clarify your question. Fibrechannel adapter logo qualification is only for the adapter and this is a basic functionality test only. That does not consider clustering.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: Clarification for "What additional tests will be needed to run for the Cluster Server Block submission?"
A: Answer was for WS2003. Win2k remains the same. Here is the procedure page that describes the rules. https://www.microsoft.com/hwdq/hwtest/search/results.asp?Type=Announcement&ID=720&Key=SysClusterServ&Sort=release&fItem=m&Term=&sType=ann&ipage=1
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: I thought that RTM mark the end of Windows 2000 clustering for adapters?
A: 2000 cluster device qualification is still being accepted because the Cluster block submission wizard is still in its final stages at present.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: Will future W2K testing need to follow the new W2k3 block testing convention?
A: Not necessarily. The cluster solution option is still available for both Windows 2000 and Windows 2003. At this point there is no plan to get rid of cluster solution.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Do switches in teh storage block need to be specified in the submittal? Will they be listed?
A: Yes, switches are part of the storage block if the configuration uses one.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: I have attempted to run the HCL tests on a suite of drivers I have written for a FC HBA. This suite does not provide a SCSI miniport since it uses the FC HBA as a high-speed communications device in a peer to peer configuration.
A: Which suite? Using a scsi miniport for a fibrechannel HBA is a normal implementation. If the HCT is not working on this specific driver implementation we need to investigate this offline. This probably does not concern clustering and we would like you
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Is "Print Server Testing" optional for W2k testing. It is not part of the default configuration
A: Yes, this is an optional testing.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: I have attempted to run the HCL tests on a suite of drivers I have written for a FC HBA. This suite does not provide a SCSI miniport since it uses the FC HBA as a high-speed communications device in a peer to peer configuration.
A: Which suite? Using a scsi miniport for a fibrechannel HBA is a normal implementation. If the HCT is not working on this specific driver implementation we need to investigate this offline. This probably does not concern clustering and we would like you to pursue this whqlraid@microsoft.com.
Host: Daryn (Microsoft)
Q: Why is EQP better than Server Blocks? If under EQP, I have to list "every possible" configuration, including the Storage device on the WC. But under "Server Block" Model, I only list each Server Block.
A: I wouldn't say one is better then the other, they are two different options. EQP has more flexibility and after initial submissions doesn't require test logs. With Server block you rely on the Storage block being submitted to get a listing for a cluster qualification. Please look at this document for details on the programs https://www.microsoft.com/hwdq/hwtest/search/results.asp?Type=Announcement&ID=720&Key=SysClusterServ&Sort=release&fItem=m&Term=&sType=ann&ipage=1
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: If we have a Cluster Server Block logo'd and a Cluster Storage Block logo'd, will we need to run the different Phase tests? You know Phase 1, Phase 2, Phase 3, etc...
A: If you have a Server Block and Storage Block that are qualified using EXACTLY the same HBA, then a cluster using the combination of the two can be considered as logo’d.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: can we get a digital signature for Multi-Path software through the cluster device submittal process instead of storage/raid system process?
A: We don’t provide signatures under the block model or accept drivers for review. For MPIO to be selected as an attribute under cluster storage block the storage device must be previously qualified as MPIO and the drivers must be previously signed.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Is there any likelihood of MSCS having the shared-everything clustering model at any time in the future?
A: We are addressing questions regarding qualification only. There is no plan as of today to support shared-everything model.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: I developed a Fibre Channel bus driver that enumerates a bus. The FDO's that are enumerated are for an FSD and a peer to peer ultra-high speed communications server. It basically sidesteps the SCSI portion of the HBA and capitalizes on the speed
A: Please consider taking this issue to whqlraid@microsoft.com <mailto:whqlraid@microsoft.com>. We will help get the right parties together to help you.
Host: Daryn (Microsoft)
Q: Are the Enterprise and DC versions test the same. Will certification in one imply the other? What bout 2-4-6-8 node certs?
A: For W2K, the 4 node testing only exists for DC. For W2003 Server the Kits are the same for Enterprise Server and DC regardless of nodes.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: Can a Multi Cluster logo be replaced by Cluster Device
A: Cluster Device qualification has been eliminated as a program. The storage multi-cluster "Designed for Windows" logo qualification is required before any RAID system that supports clustering can be considered qualified by Windows Hardware Quality Labs (WHQL) for use in a storage area network (SAN)-based cluster environment.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Will the introduction of the new StorPort SCSI driver have any influence on how blocks are handled? If not, why not?
A: Test has not change and will not. Storport driver working properly should do the proper translation of the scsi bus commands.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: when will WHQL stop accepting 2000 cluster device qualifications
A: Shortly, as soon as we can change the log review chm and clean out the final bugs in the cluster block submission wizard.
Host: Daryn (Microsoft)
Q: In 2003 if we do a DC cert will it also give us Enterprise cert?
A: Yes
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: Before we used to have to used logo'd Servers within a Cluster submission. So, if our logo'd Server is logo'd using an HBA than we can go ahead and use it within our Cluster Server Block?
A: You must still logo qualify the server and HBA as individual base submissions. Then each can be included in the Server Cluster Block.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: Then can I us a Multi-Cluster Logo instead of the cluster block
A: Multi-cluster qualification qualifies a storage device for MS PSS support in a SAN environment. Cluster storage block can be matched with a cluster server block to provide multiple listings for cluster solutions. Multi-cluster qualification test logs may be used instead of cluster storage block test logs.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Follow-up with Zubair and StorPort. Clarification - will we be required to do additional tests for boot and cluster disk off the same adapter?
A: Don't understand the question. we require separate bus for boot and shared storage.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q. Zubair-msft - Thanks - I know where the link is - however my team hit issue with 9.502 and did not see them when using 9.501 - ????
A: 9.51 may be used instead of HCT 9.502 for cluster device submissions optionally. For server cluster submissions 9.51 is required.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Are Majority Node Sets handled differently in block concept or solutions
A: There is no separate qualification or listing for MNS clusters . If MNS cluster uses shared disk then it must be tested with cluster HCT for listing regardless of the model of qualification
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: Under the cluster submission processes document, what is the difference between Nnodesim and Phase1:Cli/Srv for the cluster device suite?
A: These are the same tests. Just different names as the test has versioned.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: Is it a requirement to run Raid Device tests BEFORE making a Raid Multi-Cluster submission?
A: Yes.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: If the Server is logo'd, & the HBA is logo'd, & the Storage Block is logo'd do we still need to run the different Phase Tests?
A: You will still need to logo the Cluster Server Block (Logo’d Server + Logo’d HBA). This requires the different Phase Tests.
Host: Zubair (Microsoft)
Q: Does obtaining Multi-Cluster stauts mean support for up to 3 clusters or 3 + clusters ?
A: It means you can deploy this cluster in a shared fabric environment and Microsoft will support it.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: So, what's the difference between the old Cluster certification procedure and the new one?
A: Cluster Solution is still an option. There is now the addition of the Cluster Block option and EQP.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: If multi-path software version 1.0 is signed, will a roll to version 1.1 (bug fix) require a new signature?
A: Changed driver will have no signature and will not receive PSS support till signed and logo’d as part of a hardware logo submission.
Here is a great resource. It will eventually replace the HCL. Multi-cluster and MPIO configurations are now visible. Driver and firmware qualification information now available.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: Will we than still need the Storage Device to run the Cluster Server Block tests?
A: Yes.
Host: Shawn (Microsoft)
Q: Is the only difference between a Server submission and a Cluster Server block the fact that one has an HBA?
A: No. A Cluster Server Block submission is tested in a cluster environment and requires completely different tests.
Host: Jason (Microsoft)
Q: Can you list (WC) multiple storage solutions with one Server Cluster submission? (Certifying multiple storage solutions at the same time).
A: No. We do not have this capability on the WinQual site at this time. You can, however, test using multiple storage devices and submit the same logs for the 2 cluster submissions cluster 1 w/ stor A; cluster 2 w/ stor B. Please note this in the readme for each submission to avoid unnecessary failures.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: For clarification: if our multi-path software supports 6 arrays, and we roll it to add support for a 7th array, will we have to get new signatures for the previous 6 arrays?
A: Heterogeneous storage policy is not available for storage block or cluster device we are working on adding some scalability here. Sig only applies to one configuration.
Host: Lyndon (Microsoft)
Q: With Multi-Cluster Device submissions, can we have multiple storage boxes tested at the same time, and then submit the same logs for each different storage array ?
A: Heterogeneous storage policy is not available for storage block or cluster device we are working on adding some scalability here. It's in the works.
https://msdn.microsoft.com/chats/recent.asp.
Moderator: Eric (Microsoft)
Thanks for joining us today and thanks for the questions. It's time for us to go now. If we couldn't get to your question, please post it at news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windowsXP.winlogo.
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